Manoj Jhaveri on Creating Win-Win for Physician Staffing

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Bill Russell / Manoj Jhaveri

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Manoj Jhaveri a co-founder of HYR Medical explains how digital has created a win/win for physician staffing.  

Bill Russell:                   00:08                Welcome for this week in health it influence where we discuss the influence of technology on health with people who are making it happen. My name is Bill Russell. Recovering healthcare CIO and creator this week and health it instead of podcasts and videos dedicated to developing the next generation of Health IQ. Agers. This podcast is brought to you by health lyrics. Professional athletes hire coaches for every aspect of their life. To ensure top performance healthcare technology is much more important. It may be time to get a coach in your corner, contact health Lyrics.com to schedule your free consultation. If you want to support the fastest growing podcast and health it space five easy ways you can do it. Share with a peer, share it on social media. Follow our social accounts, linkedin, Twitter, Youtube. Send me feedback @billatthisweekinhealthit.com. Love your feedback and subscribe to our newsletter on the website.

Bill Russell:                   00:51                Uh, one last thing before we get to our guests. We have two new services this week. Health insights, which is developed for uh, people to develop their career. Uh, check that out on our website this week Health.com slash insights and a staff meeting, which is a way to introduce your staff to new concepts and to kick off your staff meeting with a dynamic conversation this week Health.com Slash staff meeting. No spaces. Okay. Today I’m joined by, Manoj. How do you spell, how do you say your last name? I don’t want to, I don’t know. Butcher it. Thanks. It’s very okay. Manoj Jhaveri the co founder and CEO of higher medical, uh, a healthcare tech startup based in Cleveland, Ohio. Uh, which is how we got connected through a, our friend, Charlei Lougheed, who’s also a, a Cleveland Native and entrepreneur in that area. And I guess you guys, you guys have known each other for a little bit.

Manoj Jhaveri:              01:44                Yeah. Great to be here with you, Bill. We’ve known each other for for a bit and, uh, several years now and he’s actually an advisor to higher medical as well.

Bill Russell:                   01:53                Okay. And now he’s doing his, his blockchain thing now.

Manoj Jhaveri:              01:57                Yeah. And it’s an amazing concept. Um, I’ve seen some of the early, uh, Alphas and Betas of their software and we’ve actually been meeting with his team, um, on some potential collaborations as well. So some really exciting stuff that they’re doing.

Bill Russell:                   02:13                Yeah. So we’re going to, we’re going to talk about hire medical. It’d be interesting to see, you know, given what you’re doing, um, you know, his, his, his blockchain technology and I don’t want to get you in trouble by you revealing anything that you’ve seen from him cause he was, he was a little coy of sharing things, but he was, we talked a lot about blockchain and, and it as a foundation for, um, for a lot of really cool new use cases within healthcare. So it’s pretty exciting. Um, so hire a higher medical. So you, that’s, that’s where you’re at now, your co founder and CEO, uh, prior background with, uh, innovation in fortune 500 companies and a faculty member at Case Western Reserve University as well, where you’re taught to innovation management and a marketing strategy. Are you still doing that? You’re still teaching,

Manoj Jhaveri:              03:02                not teaching anymore. Just full time. Higher medical all day. Every day.

Bill Russell:                   03:06                Yeah. It’s Kinda Kinda hard to keep that balance and keep doing other things, isn’t it? Once you really turn your sights onto being a, a, an entrepreneur and really making it happen.

Manoj Jhaveri:              03:19                Yeah. Yeah. I’m, I’m fortunate that I can dedicate that focus to, to just higher medical right now.

Bill Russell:                   03:26                Cool. Well let’s, let’s dive into this cause I, it’s a really fascinating, uh, you know, direction that you guys are going. So higher medical was founded to really disrupt in a good way the, uh, the, the broken process of, uh, freelance healthcare staffing that currently exist. And uh, so give us a little bit background of higher medical. Um, yeah. And now I’d just like to go into, you know, just really your thought process from a, uh, from an entrepreneur standpoint, how you got there, how you plan to scale and those kinds of things.

Manoj Jhaveri:              03:55                Yeah, absolutely. I’ll kind of give you the genesis story. Uh, in a nutshell. Um, so my background was engineering then management consulting and I a little bit fell into startup entrepreneurship and start up technology on entrepreneurship to be more specific by accident. Um, it’s not like I set out to get into health care, you know, create a healthcare startup. And, um, I had a, I had my own consulting company, I was an entrepreneur for sure, but the whole startup game is something of a completely different nature. And, um, what actually happened is while I was, um, having my own independent consulting company, I was looking for ways to bring startup culture and processes into big companies. So I went to a startup competition and I actually participated in it. And coincidentally, one of the people who was pitching there was Dr Ferris, AlKadir, who was pitching an idea and not hire medical.

Manoj Jhaveri:              04:49                And I didn’t know Ferris, I had never met him in my life. And I, I liked the idea he was talking about though. And I ended up working with him for 54 hours. I’m like one of these build a business hackathons. And through that 54 hours, we kind of jelled and became friends and we ended up winning that competition. So we started working on that together. And, um, fast forward, we later presented that idea to Matthew Miller, who’s now a venture partner at jumpstart in Cleveland. Uh, we didn’t end up taking that idea forward, but we had another idea in our back pocket which was born out of the pain that Ferris actually was experiencing firsthand trying to do freelance work or locums work is what they sometimes call it as a side Gig to make extra money because he was a fellow at Cleveland Clinic and fellows don’t make very much money.

Manoj Jhaveri:              05:40                Residents, fellows, they make about 50,000 a year. Right? So he wanted to augment his salary, also pay down a student loans. That’s a typical story for folks in his position. And he said the entire process sucks. Um, it feels like he’s at a time warp of 19, 1990s. You know, really no automation or technology is really being brought to the table and there’s no online platform. There’s a complete lack of visibility between the doctor and the hospital. Um, and that, that, um, you know, that lack of visibility, that lack of transparency is actually something in our opinion that agencies want to maintain. Um, their markups are very high in agencies. Typical markup on the doctors rate is 40 to 60%, sometimes more. And they’ll often negotiate or haggle is what we call it with the doctor to bring them down. There’s a lot of discrimination actually that occurs in this area as well against women, minorities, et Cetera, and bring down their rate and then keep as much markup as they can for themselves.

Manoj Jhaveri:              06:45                And then of course they try to charge the hospital as much as they can as well. Um, in this market, um, finding a freelance position, finding a locum position typically happens through an agency that’s the predominant model in today’s world. Nine Times out of 10. And um, you know, job postings are put out there, but the rate and the exact location is not revealed in the job posting cause the hospital that the agency doesn’t want them to do an end around and cut them out of their, um, juicy margin. Right. And we just, we just looked at all of these things that we just felt it was just wrong and it was time for a more modern solution. You know, you don’t, you don’t haggle a rate with your Uber driver, you don’t haggle rate with your airbnb host. Uh, you don’t haggle the rate on Travelocity.

Manoj Jhaveri:              07:28                And in all of these industries that I’m talking about, I’ve been disintermediate. The, the middle man has been removed. And we said, well, why doesn’t this happen in healthcare? You know, why can’t this happen? And our, our hypothesis was that it can happen, um, and maybe no one has had the right team or the resources or whatever it might be to kind of, you know, make this happen and fight this battle. We didn’t understand later that there were some, some companies that, a couple of companies really that were doing this and looking at, um, really disrupting the space. Uh, but at the time, um, we, you know, we thought, hey, maybe we’re the only ones out there. We’re trying to do this. And, and we, we embarked on this journey and we ended up picking up multiple advisors along the way. Charlie being one of them.

Manoj Jhaveri:              08:13                Um, and we ended up, uh, in that process, I met, uh, Oliver Cholas, who’s our chief technology officer. And then also about a year and over a year ago, I met Sunil Pandya, uh, Dr. Snow Pandya who is, um, very experienced physician and the practice manager and doc. And then Spencer Liebman who, uh, also lives in Florida. Snow and Spencer are good friends. Spencer’s our chief operating officer now. They initially started off on a part time role and then they just saw the logic of what we’re doing and became so excited that they ended up joining as co founders and executives. So I tell that because it definitely takes a, a village and um, and you know, we have a, uh, balance, I would say an experienced team of five cofounders and executives and two of them are doctors, two of them are MBAs. Uh, you know, we have, we have a mix of different personalities and, and experiences. We have experienced advisers who have been there, done that. Even in the case of Charlie, he’s, he’s created and sold healthcare it companies specifically IBM, you know, are explorers and then became IBM Watson health. Um, so that’s kind of the genesis of how we, we created this company and it, the seed of it started two years ago and the goal really was to make this process of freelance positioning finally make it easy and

Bill Russell:                   09:36                right. So here’s what I’m going to do. So you just laid it out and here’s what my listeners really want me to do. They want me to take you through the process. So great. You have a great idea. You found some partners, you pulled it together. I assume you got some funding, right? So you have some funding as well. So now we’re going to take it from, we have a great idea. It seems to solve this, this problem. Let’s, let’s take it all the way through. So let’s start with you create a digital marketplace. It doesn’t sound like, um, you know, this is like sort of the hallmark of digital business in general. You cut out a middle man, you make the process a lot easier, really for both sides, more transparent for both sides. Make the transaction a lot easier for both sides. Um, what are the things that stand in the way of, of you growing the business or scaling the business at this point?

Manoj Jhaveri:              10:28                Um, I mean I think one of the biggest, I wouldn’t call it a a barrier, but I think it is, there’s an education process that has to take place with hospitals.

Bill Russell:                   10:39                Oh, of the hospitals, not the physicians. The physicians sort of get it.

Manoj Jhaveri:              10:43                I think. I mean I think they are warm and eager to adopt this type of more modern solution. I mean our, our doctors, our users is what we call them users. And then we call the hospitals the customer. So our users are begging for this kind of solution. And they say, well, you know, we get comments from people saying, oh, finally, you know, finally I get to experience, um, being a freelance position in a way that is not nice mind numbing and where I have to fill out papers by hand and I get a big packet of stuff in a Manila envelope and I have faxes and um, I have to do everything and kind of, uh, a very old school kind of way or no reason. And, um, you know, you guys are speeding up that process and you’re also allowing me to interact directly with the hospital and see the rate and see the location and you’re just, you’re treating me in a way where you’re not even worried about me cutting you out because your markup is so much lower than a typical agency hours as a 20% markup across the board.

Manoj Jhaveri:              11:46                Um, and we, you know, we have agreements on both sides, but our, our, our philosophy is not, oh, we need to stop people from cutting around us. Our philosophy is make the platform and the experience so easy that people don’t think about moving around you. You know, you don’t think about getting the, the cell phone number of your Uber driver because it’s a pain. It’s so easy to use Uber. They say, I’m not going to get my guy’s cell phone right or I’m not going to get my airbnb host cell phone number. Um, and their fee is also is to follow a similar structure. They’re not so exorbitantly high. Right?

Bill Russell:                   12:19                So you’re making the credentialing process, that whole, you know, verification process, you’re making that pretty easy on the user side is that

Manoj Jhaveri:              12:26                we’re making that easier. I would say, you know, we’re three x, um, you know, factor better than the competitor, but that’s not good enough. Right. And the reason we are talking to, um, actual is at Charlie’s company is because there happens to be a synergy there where his company is focused on blockchain based credentialing and verification and reducing and removing actually eliminating the turn that exists today. So when I explained this to people, they don’t necessarily who aren’t in healthcare, they don’t realize that when a doctor works somewhere and goes through all the pain and effort of having every single aspect of their professional life, uh, verified when they go work at a different hospital, that whole process happens again from scratch.

Bill Russell:                   13:16                Yeah. That is,

Manoj Jhaveri:              13:17                there is no reuse or leveraging of past verification of information. Every healthcare system says no, you know, for whatever reason or liability for whatever, we’re going to do it all over again. And My, and our philosophy is that’s just insane.

Bill Russell:                   13:32                So I’m, I’m going to annoy you here, but essentially, okay, so you have a dating site and you have all these men signing up. Well now you have to have some women signing up as well. So you have users and now you need health systems that are going to hire them. So what’s the value proposition to the health system?

Manoj Jhaveri:              13:49                So the value prop for the health system is number one, what they care about is quality. This is all the interviews we’ve done and all of our actual in-market work on sales. Right. Actually, you know, we have, we have over 20 major clients on our platform. We have, you know, um, several dozen, you know, uh, you know, significant freelance and then even some perm jobs as well, but mostly freelance. And, um, you know, we, we signed Cleveland Clinic, we’ve signed some other big, um, health systems that are out there. And, and so what we, what we, the approach we took to crack this nut is we want to bring on these big clients, these big name, what we call lighthouse clients and allow that halo effect to then draw in some of the smaller, more rural hospitals. A lot of these rural hospitals, um, bill actually have much more needs on a per volume basis than I, than a big hospital, right?

Manoj Jhaveri:              14:45                Because Cleveland Clinic, you know, it’s, it’s got, it’s an area of Cleveland that is saturated with doctors. They don’t have a lot of trouble finding doctors, right? They don’t have a lot of shortages locally. Right. Um, you know, take a take a hospital in Mississippi or something, they might have more issues, uh, just demographically. So, um, but what we found is that as we sign more lighthouse accounts, the smaller hospitals are more likely to gravitate to us because they say, oh, well you’re already working with these big guys. Um, they have probably put you through the ringer with legal compliance and supplier compliance and everything. So we kind of trust that they’ve kind of been an oracle kind of on your network and that kind of gives them a vote of confidence. And that’s exactly what we’ve seen. Our sales cycle is getting faster and faster.

Bill Russell:                   15:33                So you start in Cleveland, you go to the clinic and you sign the clinic and you signed university and now you’re signed with some of the big players in that market. And then from there it gets pretty easy to go out. But how do you expand beyond Cleveland? All right, so now you want to go to, uh, let’s say the east coast. Do you pick a market and start signing up users and systems?

Manoj Jhaveri:              15:55                So what would we have done, Bill, is that to get those lighthouse accounts, we have a number one spends for instance, know, don’t live in Cleveland. They live in Florida. Um, and the fact that they live there actually benefits us a lot because southeast us and the Midwest have a lot of needs for freelance positions. So those are our biggest areas. We’re actually in about 15, 16 states right now. And we are opportunistic at this point where if we have a warm relationship, I mean, Spencer himself has been in this traditional locums business for over 15 years. Sonils whole professional life has been, you know, building these kinds of connections. Um, Charlie’s one of our advisors, he’s made introductions for us, Matthew Miller, um, all of these people. So we are more than anything using our cofounder and advisor network to build the relationships. And then those relationships often lead to more relationships and referrals and that’s how we’ve gone to market with getting those signed up.

Manoj Jhaveri:              16:53                Um, so we actually have cut across more than just Ohio. We’re in, you know, like I said, 15 states and then, uh, uh, at the same time, of course, we are signing up doctors, right? So we have about 400 doctors now on our platform. So you know, it, it’s important for us to do that synchronously. But what we have found is that usually the, you know, the, the, the, the jobs kind of lead the doctor versus the other way around. We want to get some good jobs on there that are viable and then launch marketing campaigns immediately following that and get more doctors and that, that tracks them and it has more sticking power when they see jobs on the platform that are relevant. And then, like you said, it’s a two sided marketplace. So you’ve, you’ve, you’ve sort of have to know, let me start at least the, the chicken and egg aspect here. Let me start with the chicken and maybe then go to the egg and you, so does that answer your question?

Bill Russell:                   17:51                Yeah, it really does. So do you think, um, you know, one of the things is when you looked at all these freelance sites, I know that, you know, this, this whole concept has been around for many years within healthcare, but you’ve seen sort of this free agent nation sort of rise, um, uh, really across the country and across the globe. In terms of my ability to, um, you know, you’ve, you’ve seen a ton of Uber drivers now that wouldn’t normally normally necessarily be cab drivers. You see a lot of developers doing freelance work and that good stuff. Do you think this is going to change the nature of how physicians go, uh, think about employment and go to market? Will this, this easing of this marketplace change it, do you think?

Manoj Jhaveri:              18:37                I think it’s fundamentally going to transform it. I think that, you know, the thing I talked about with, um, space and time, you know, you know, if you have a bunch of doctors in, in, in Metro Cleveland, but then around Metro Cleveland, you don’t have enough and they’re just like a desert of, of medical desert, right? If you can, you know, find a way to quickly get resources where there’s saturation to places where there’s not saturation, part of that is the credentialing time, right? If today’s world that takes four to six months to credential a doctor, wow, that’s just unacceptable. I mean, your whole life could have changed in six months, right? And then you don’t even want to freelance anymore. Um, so we believe that more doctors will want to do this kind of work if you pay them more, which we do, we pay our doctors more.

Manoj Jhaveri:              19:26                The reason we’re able to do that is because we have a digital model with the low over it, right? So we, we actually charged the hospital a little bit less and we pay the doctors more because for hospitals, most important is quality. Number two is speed. Number three is cost per hour for the doctor. Number one is typically the cost of the, the rate they’re going to make. And number two is the speed which was with which they can make it then. And that relates to credentialing and matching and, and so the other thing I didn’t mention that’s also very important is for the hospital, it’s not about the cost per hour, it’s the reason they call it the speed being so important. Number two is because if they can, if they have a shortage and they can staff it quickly and fill the gap, they have less revenue leakage.

Manoj Jhaveri:              20:13                They can keep the throughput at the same amount or higher without burning out the existing staff, which as you probably know, Dr Burnout is a huge problem, and it’s not their fault. It’s their, they’re being, you know, pushed to do, you know, charts and EMR and they’re pushed to do all these things. And then they’re saying, well, no, you got to keep the same throughput and so you, you, you know, so I also, you have a lot more people who are looking at the W2 model and being part of a hospital. And that’s not necessarily what want to do for their work and their life integration. They, they truly want to be physicians. They spent, you know, up to 35 years of their life getting to that point. And, um, and, and they want to have time with their children. They want to have family time, they want to be able to vacation.

Manoj Jhaveri:              21:02                And, and you have retiring doctors who want to semi retire and 40% of physicians are above the age of 50, 55 years old, right? So we have that issue happening in the country too, with the aging population. And workforce. So how do you, yeah. And then you also have the numbers showing that the shortage is actually increasing. The raw shortage is increasing in the United States. Yup. The number of, of seats and Medicare funding for residency teachers, et Cetera, is not keeping pace with the demand because we have an aging population and an ACA and other things.

Bill Russell:                   21:37                You know, it’s, it’s, it’s interesting cause somebody’s gonna listen to this and go, man, is higher medical paying Bill to be on this show? And the answer’s no, because I think it’s a great example of digital transformation and it doesn’t really require anything from the it department. Essentially, you’re going to come in, you already have this market place, establish their connect, you’re connecting these physicians who are looking, uh, looking for this type of work with the health system that’s also looking for these people to do this kind of work. And you know, there’s, there’s really an, and you’re, you’re, uh, you’re automating and you’re digitizing this entire process, which is, you know, it’s, it’s, it’s gonna help them drive down. The cost is there. So my question becomes, you know, when you add a, a lot of people are trying to reduce their number of vendors, but adding a vendor like you to this process because it’s sort of a digital agency, I would imagine the overhead’s not all that great to have an addition to add additional vendor in this, in this space for them, I wouldn’t think.

Manoj Jhaveri:              22:41                Yeah. Yeah. I mean, so number one, our entire agreement Bill is an unheard of one page long,

Manoj Jhaveri:              22:50                our entire agreement with the hospital. Um, and we do that because it’s completely transparent. We’re not trying to hide anything. There’s no, there’s not a lot of legal jargon and stuff going on there. It’s very clear about what we charge. Um, at 20% markup that I mentioned, it’s very clear that our freelance, the permanent conversion is only 10,000. So that’s another thing. We have completely undercut the, um, the contingent and permanent staffing companies purposely. Because what we’re basically saying to healthcare systems is try before you buy, this is another aspect of our business model. You know, in today’s world, what happens is when a doctor finishes residency and they’re, they want to be an attending somewhere, they interviewed a bunch of places and they get, they get a job offer to be a W2 somewhere and that’s it. They haven’t auditioned there. They haven’t like got to know the people there like that.

Manoj Jhaveri:              23:47                Well over a month maybe or something like that. And what we’re saying is that’s very risky. You know, you’re, you’re bringing on someone and they might have, uh, you know, great marks and all that stuff. But what if, what if they don’t fit in culturally right into that, that place. And so the reason that hospitals don’t do it though is because they don’t try before you buy like a few different doctors, a few different shifts a week because they don’t want to pay 40 to $50,000 at the end of that to convert them. And also most agencies put a lot of stipulations that say, if you’re going to use our freelance person, you have to use them this many shifts and only then you can convert them. We have nothing like that. I don’t even

Bill Russell:                   24:30                How do you ensure quality. So that’s one of the things that, uh, an agency would say as a sort of rebuttal to this. As, you know, we, we, we vet our people better. We make sure that we have higher quality people there. Just anyone who wants to sign on sign up, we’ll they’ll let sign up.

Manoj Jhaveri:              24:46                Yeah. I mean we actually vet our people probably better than most agencies do. Wow. How can you say that? We follow an MCQA base primary source verification process. It’s a 10 point checklist, right? That MCQA defines NC QA is similar to Jayco and that way the Jayco Standard Jayco is more for hospitals. Um, MCQA kind of came more from the payer community and um, we’re, we’re following a rigorous process of background screening and, and primary source verification, looking at things like sanctions and um, you know, medical malpractice history and things like that. We are not, even after a doctor applies to a job in our platform, the hospital is not notified. The hospital is only notified of a doctor applying after we’ve vetted them. We take that very seriously. There’s already been two doctors that we rejected. I can name them off the bat, right where we said, no, we would, that means they were ready to work.

Bill Russell:                   25:43                Yeah. Let’s not actually name them.

Manoj Jhaveri:              25:46                I will not name them, but, but, uh, you know, I mean, we care about the patient’s health. We have doctors as part of our company, right? We actually also have, um, six doctors who are our, um, uh, regional vice presidents to have different areas that we, you know, have a lot of focus on like, uh, like hospital medicine, EM, anesthesia, psych, et cetera. And so we have a, we have a company that is, you know, uh, it’s, it’s created by many doctors and many non-doctors too, but we care about the patient’s health. Uh, we’re not going to compromise that for revenue and, um, we have rejected physicians and we’ll continue to do that to ensure high quality. Um, another thing that’s big and important to us is that in today’s world, freelance physicians don’t get recognized for being good freelance physicians. Right? It’s just kind of, everyone’s just kind of treated the same.

Manoj Jhaveri:              26:37                And so what we’re gonna Start doing pretty soon, we’re implementing this as we speak, is we’re going to be rolling out a program where we give badges to people for either being like road warriors or getting like high quality scores from, uh, from a hospital. Um, you know, whether they have a lot of mobility or experience with EMR systems so they actually can get recognized for having some unique capabilities. And when a hospital actually signs up with us, they get both sides that sign up for free, by the way. So it’s free for a hospital to join and free for a doctor to join our platform. The only time higher medical makes money is after a doctor completes their shifts. We make our 20% Mark up.

Manoj Jhaveri:              27:17                When a, when a, when a hospital cray has an account and they look at their dashboard, they can search every doctor in the system. And when, when a doctor creates a, uh, an account, they can search every single job in our entire system. That’s interesting. No. Where else can you do like that and then look at the exact rate you’re gonna make and exactly where you’re going to work. It sounds so simple, but

Bill Russell:                   27:40                oh no it is. So I’m going to take you off higher at this point. How do you think about money as a startup? How should a young aspiring a health tech entrepreneur think about money and raising money for their startup?

Manoj Jhaveri:              27:55                well I think first of all, you’ve got to think of that money as money you put in. You know, I have multiple, some of my best friends in the world have put money into this company. Um, and, and a lot of other people have put in money. Actually we have probably 12 investors that are, are, are physicians and then a few other physician industrials as well on our cap table. You got to think of that money as your money. You got to spend it wisely. Um, I did not take a salary for 18 months, just using myself as an example. I mean we, everyone on the executive team has sacrificed a lot salary wise. Um, and I only started paying myself about four months ago. And it’s a very, it’s a, it’s a low salary. It’s enough to get by. Uh, we were talking a lot about airbnb. Um, I airbnb my house, I’m actually a superhost. That’s how I, that’s how I pay my mortgage. Yeah. So that’s how I think about money. I mean, that’s, that right there tells you how I think about it.

Bill Russell:                   28:51                So as you’re, as you’re out there, have you identified other, you know, so you’re creating this digital marketplace and you’re sort of milling around. Do you see other areas where health systems really could use automation or digitizing a process that you’re saying, man, I, I hope a startup gets into that space?

Manoj Jhaveri:              29:09                Um, I mean, I think there’s a lot of room and, and you know what, what’s, uh, I mean, just healthcare in general, right? Broadly time. I just, just broadly, yeah. You know, obviously I love the whole credentialing space. We’ve talked about that, you know, on the both, on the, on the hospital side for physicians and on the payer side, it’s, it’s big there as well. So we haven’t even talked about payer enrollment. Um, and, and all of the, uh, you know, lean processes and technology that can be applied there. Um, I think, I think in areas like prescription drugs, I mean it sounds simple what Amazon did with buying like a, um, a pill, a pill box or I forgot the name of the company.

Bill Russell:                   29:47                Yeah. PillPack

Manoj Jhaveri:              29:48                PillPack um, I mean I think they’re looking to really change the way people are getting their, uh, their drugs. And you know, when you look at, uh, you know, uh, I have to say cover my meds, like what they did also in this space cause they’re a Columbus Cleveland based company. Um, you know, with, with prior authorization. Um, I think there’s a lot of, a lot of waste that is being taken out of that whole process. Um, the prescription drug area, I think tele-health, I mean we have a couple, um, big name tele-health companies that are going to be coming onto our platform soon. And uh, just spoke with one of them today actually. Um, I think telehealth is, is already, you know, had a big impact. But I think it’s just only, it’s only begun, um, this ability to, to again, I think almost that could be kind of like the holy grail of freelancing, you know, the ability to do it regardless of of space and time constraints and stuff. Or you know, a mother at home or a father at home with the kids, uh, says, Hey, I’m going to still work as a doctor and after the kids are asleep I’m going to do some, some consults, you know, um, you have things in the mental health space like, uh, you know, better health and things like that that I’ve, I’ve looked at and been following like some, you know, some great things and that, and that space. I think things really need to change it in the mental health space I think in America.

Bill Russell:                   31:12                Well, you know, one of the things you said, which was sort of struck me is it seems like, hey, we found this space, it looked really interesting and we went out and developed solution, but it didn’t sound to me like you did a full market analysis and said, hey, here are the 15 competitors or the 10 competitors. It seemed like you, you saw a problem and you went after it. Am I hearing that wrong or is that, is that pretty accurate?

Manoj Jhaveri:              31:35                I think one, initially when the seed of the idea was there, we started just, just gung Ho, kind of going into it for maybe two months and then after that initial two months we started to get, do more research and understand it wasn’t like the top of mind thing that we did, like competitive research, but, uh, we were kind of just seeing our instincts and kind of seeing more about the space and talking to people. And then we, we did understand that. Yeah, there are a couple significant competitors in the space, not hugely ahead of us by any means. And, and actually their philosophy is quite different than ours. You know, I, I won’t name it by name, but like one of the, one of the platforms as much for hospital centric, they’re all about saving money for the hospital. And our philosophy is completely different.

Manoj Jhaveri:              32:23                We don’t think that the hospital’s very price sensitive. You know, on a per rate basis for the doctor. The doctor is very price sensitive. And if you can pay the doctor more money, you’re gonna attract more physicians to apply to a job and therefore you have a chance, a better of getting a quality solution, which is what the hospital really, really cares about because they understand at a, at a higher level in the organization, they know a bad quality doctor is going to cost you more than anything. And so, so, you know, we, we understand and, and also the thing is too that we don’t think this is a winner take all market. We think that there will be four or five, six big, um, freelance staffing platforms out there ultimately. So, and

Bill Russell:                   33:08                if you’d got into the space and found that somebody had a big lead, you still may have continued based on how you viewed the market.

Manoj Jhaveri:              33:15                Actually, it’s, it’s helped us in so many ways to be second, second or third. That’s interesting. Saved us a lot of money actually.

Bill Russell:                   33:24                Well, no, because you’re not, you’re not, uh, you’re not educating the market completely. The market’s already being educated and in now it’s being educated by more than just one player.

Manoj Jhaveri:              33:35                And it makes it easier for us to raise money too because we can point to what that company raised and said, look, you didn’t invest in that one, but maybe you can invest in us, you know?

Bill Russell:                   33:45                Yeah. So Cleveland is interesting to me. Wait, do you guys, do you guys only focus on raising money in Cleveland or do you yeah. Yeah. Do you go to the coast to try to raise money?

Manoj Jhaveri:              33:56                I mean, I did make a couple trips to silicon valley. Um, not a whole lot. I came out of it to be honest with you. I think value investors want to see in a pre seed round. Um, I mean they, they have more startups to choose from. The volume of startups that choose from as much higher. So they are looking for a higher, um, MRR or Arr at an earlier point, much earlier point in time. And also a lot of the things they’re investing in are not healthcare it. And so it’s a little bit different on the world. Uh, we actually, um, you know, are on the, on the verge here of just closing a, uh, an angel round. We just call it our pre seed round majority of the money was from angel investors and a couple small institutions. The next round that we do will be an institutional led round. And, um, you know, that’s where we will, we will look to have one, you know, solid lead investor and maybe four or five sidecar, um, funds.

Bill Russell:                   34:57                it’s interesting. W did you take money from, would you take money from, what’d you, uh, you know, there’s, there’s a lot of health systems that have investment arms and those kinds of things. Is that, is that, is that preferred or is it, is it not?

Manoj Jhaveri:              35:12                Um, I mean, I, you know, would have to depend on the terms of it and you know, how much they would open up their business to us and what’s really up was really a partnership, you know. Uh, but there are certainly advantages of it. And, uh, you know, I’ve spoken to Charlie about some of these types of things too, and Matthew Miller as well, and you know, getting money from, uh, uh, UPFC or Cleveland Clinic or, uh, you know, some of these types of, of institutions. You know, there are definitely advantages to it. Um, I don’t really see a whole lot of downside to be honest with you. Uh, and I can only help to kind of increase your, your market presence. And maybe the only downside is that, you know, an existing system or something sees it as like, well, you’re, you’re kind of partnered or aligned with this particular system. But I don’t, I don’t think that’s much of a thing. Most systems are gonna want to understand the value proposition for them and whether it makes sense.

Bill Russell:                   36:08                Yeah, no, I think so as well. Uh, Manoj. Thanks for coming on the show. Any, anything you want to leave the listeners with,

Manoj Jhaveri:              36:16                ah, leave listeners with? Um, I think it’s great that you have a healthcare it focused podcast. Um, I think, uh, you know, I’m really grateful for you having me on the show and if anyone wants to check us out, I mean we’re on all the socials, so linkedin, Twitter and Facebook. So check out higher medical there. Uh, we use the Hashtag the higher life a lot. So you know,thehyr life and check out www.hyrmed.com. That’s Hyr m e d.com. And that’s about it. We look forward to hearing, hearing from you.

Bill Russell:                   36:51                Just out of curiosity, how, how hard was it to come up with the name?

Manoj Jhaveri:              36:56                You know what the funny thing is, the name, the very beginning name was H. I g h e r higher medical. And uh, we like me and Ferris, we like, we liked it, uh, but we were like, you know, something’s missing here. You know, it doesn’t look like we’re a tech company. And, and then I, I was like, thinking about it one day, I’m like, you know, tech companies always misspell purposely their name, like lifts, you know, is spelled like, you know, LF Whitey. And I was like, you know, what if we did like Hyr, you know, and that we looked up the URL and no one had hyrmed.com and then that was it.

Bill Russell:                   37:33                Yeah, that’s, that’s usually the, uh, the last step is to, to go out there and look at the, uh, look at the URL. Can you get it? And, uh, that, that determines whether you’re going to take the name. Now it’s a, it’s, it’s a great name and I love what you guys are doing. I’d love to see you and, uh, and Charlie and the actual stuff really come together cause I think that could be a really powerful, uh, combination with that as a credentialing platform and, um, and such, such a smart guy, a great guy to have, have as your advisor. So thanks guys. Thanks again for coming on. I appreciate it. Uh, please come back every Friday for more great interviews with influencers. And don’t forget, every Tuesday we take a look at the news, which is impacting health it. It shows a production of this week in health it for more great content. You check out our website at this week health.com or the youtube channel this week health.com and just click on that video link at the top. Easiest way to get there. Thanks for listening. That’s all for now. [inaudible].