August 9, 2021: Sue Schade from StarBridge Advisors joins Bill for the news. It’s the first day of HIMSS. Are you going in-person or virtually? All attendees are required to wear masks and Epic is launching EpicShare. The first dose US vaccination rate is now at 70%. Healthcare IT news have been rolling out a fantastic series on the lessons learned during the pandemic. How has the pandemic reshaped CIOs’ views on adaptability, agility, security and hiring? What’s the plan for refined telehealth, faster deployments and more collaborative tools? How do we tackle the barriers to innovation, telehealth integration and analytics? Sometimes leadership needs to get out of the way. The best thing they can do is let teams work together without walls and allow failure of ideas.
Newsday – HIMSS Plans and Pandemic Lessons Learned with Sue Schade
Episode 433: Transcript – August 9, 2021
This transcription is provided by artificial intelligence. We believe in technology but understand that even the smartest robots can sometimes get speech recognition wrong.
[00:00:00] Bill Russell: [00:00:00] Welcome to This Week in Health IT. It’s Newsday. My name is Bill Russell, former healthcare CIO for 16 hospital system and creator of This Week in Health IT, a channel dedicated to keeping health IT staff current and engaged.
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[00:01:28] It’s Newsday. And today we’ve got [00:01:30] a full docket. We’re going to talk HIMSS for the most part, because this will air on Monday, even though we’re recording the Wednesday before. A lot of things are happening with regard to HIMSS. So we’re going to talk about that. We’re going to talk about some of the lessons learned from the pandemic and we’re going to do that with Sue Schade. We’re also going to cover how a CIO goes about making a buying decision on a house and what criteria and weighting actually goes into those things.
[00:01:53]That’s obviously from an earlier conversation that Sue and I were having and it just made me laugh. So I thought I’d bring it in there. Sue welcome. [00:02:00] Welcome back to the show.
[00:02:01] Sue Schade: [00:02:01] Good to see you Bill. Happy to talk about that. I did apply some of my CIO skills to that decision.
[00:02:09] Bill Russell: [00:02:09] It’s just funny. I mean, we just, we get into this, we make so many of these decisions. We do so many contracts and we make so many of these big decisions that we, we have figured out a way to reduce the risk. And buying a house is one of those things where you just sit there and you go okay, risks pluses, minuses, let’s weigh the decision factors, all those other things.
[00:02:29] And you almost [00:02:30] can’t help yourself once your CIO. It’s a very special person that’s married to a CIO, isn’t it?
[00:02:37] Sue Schade: [00:02:37] Yeah. Right. How about, it’s a very special person married to a minister. That’s me and Tom.
[00:02:44] Bill Russell: [00:02:44] C’mon is it hard to be married to a minster?
[00:02:46] Sue Schade: [00:02:46] Oh, that I’ve learned many things from Tom once he went into the ministry. He was in IT when we got married.
[00:02:52] Bill Russell: [00:02:52] Oh, wow.
[00:02:54] Sue Schade: [00:02:54] No I think when we got married, neither one of us was in IT. We both went into IT at the same time. [00:03:00] And then much later he decided to go into the ministry. And yes, I’ve learned much from him as a minister and that’s a whole different world yeah.
[00:03:08] Bill Russell: [00:03:08] So the movie the preacher’s wife is one of my wife’s favorite Christmas. You know the one with Whitney Houston and stuff. That sort of paints this picture of it is actually a lot harder than somebody would think to be a pastor’s wife because it’s, there’s a lot of well dynamics, right? It’s people.
[00:03:27] Sue Schade: [00:03:27] It’s people. Yeah. And there’s I gotta tell you there’s [00:03:30] expectations on the minister’s wife but I was very direct about that and what’s expected and not to expect from me.
[00:03:35] Bill Russell: [00:03:35] Yeah. Your CIO training set clear expectations, communicate them effectively. And then, and then. Yeah, I used to say to my team all the time expectations are the mother of all disappointments. So if you don’t want to disappoint people, make sure you communicate clear expectations. So when somebody said to me I’ll have, I’ll send you that email this afternoon and I didn’t get it until the next day.
[00:03:56] They’re like, well, I got it to you the next day. I’m like, expectations are the mother of [00:04:00] all disciplines. If you had said, I’ll get you that email tomorrow it wouldn’t, it wouldn’t have been a problem. I wouldn’t have been expecting it that night. So anyway.
[00:04:07] Sue Schade: [00:04:07] It’s a good one. I hadn’t heard that before. That’s good.
[00:04:11]Bill Russell: [00:04:11] So we’re going to talk HIMSS. It’s a tough time to be in the in-person event business I think. We saw that Black Hat had a third of their people drop out of the in-person attendance and go to digital. And I’m not even sure those are the final numbers. I think even more, probably dropped out that was the [00:04:30] Black Hat conference. And I imagine HIMSS is probably looking at the same thing. They say that they’re at roughly 20,000 people signed up for digital and onsite. But my guess is just based on conversations, I made the decision. Yeah. Not to go after a conversation with my wife and my family, and just weighing the risks and professional obligations. I had some sponsor obligations and I just, I stepped away from some of those and made the decision that was right for me. And I think everybody has to [00:05:00] do that. It’s a tough time to be in the in-person events business. I have the utmost empathy for them.
[00:05:06]Sue Schade: [00:05:06] I do too. You use the 20,000 number. They’re not publicizing, at least I haven’t seen how many of those are actually in-person versus digital or virtual. And there were a lot of us like myself, who in the beginning, decided to register for digital and not go to HIMSS in August for a number of reasons. And now, like you, there’s probably a lot of [00:05:30] people that I guess at the last minute are flipping at, however you do that. So it is a tough time for them to be in business. I registered for the time Paul forum, just the other day. And I’m thinking even how things are going, what’s that going to be like that at the end of October? So that’s what almost three months away?
[00:05:48] Bill Russell: [00:05:48] Three months away San Diego. Very different. Actually, if HIMSS was in Orlando, I think it would have been a different, I mean, different dynamic clearly because it’s Florida [00:06:00] versus Nevada, but different dynamic because HIMSS Orlando is much more spread out I believe. I mean, it’s, there’s just a lot of opportunity to be really creative around that they could have still done vaccination required. They could have still done masks and social distancing. But I think. It might’ve helped a little, I’m not sure it would have helped. We’re in the middle of this spike right now and it just bad timing.
[00:06:23] Sue Schade: [00:06:23] Yeah. And there’s hotspots. And that’s part of it. Maybe if it had maybe HIMSS was in one of the new England states, [00:06:30] which aren’t really hot spots and very highly vaccinated population, maybe, maybe it would have been different, but we are aware we are. Vaccines work and more people should get vaccinated right at this point in time.
[00:06:43]Bill Russell: [00:06:43] Low sixties is people that have been fully vaccinated. I think. Don’t quote me on that, but I know it’s low sixties is at least people that have been vaccinated with their first shot, and then you still have the other 40%.
[00:06:58] And actually that [00:07:00] varies by state and by location. This variant is a lot more contagious than the previous variant. Yes, more people should get vaccinated. But even if you’re vaccinated as this is the HIMSS 21 to require masks for all attendees. And it was it was a vaccination only event. I understood that actually, that made perfect sense to me when this came out, I even thought it should be the case prior to the spike. And the reason was because you can’t, it’s Vegas, you can’t [00:07:30] contain the conference to the conference.
[00:07:32] So all of us at HIMSS vaccinated, but that doesn’t mean everybody in the casino is vaccinated and everybody, and there’s almost nowhere, no way to walk around a conference in Vegas without interacting with a ton of people. It’s interesting because again, I think it did work against them, but they’re going to, so just getting back to this story, so people are going to be going.
[00:07:54] And they are, they’re doing a ton of things to make it as safe as possible. Vaccine only, [00:08:00] require masks and social distancing based on the guidelines. In this article says, according to HIMSS, more than 18,000 people have registered for digital and in-person experience with new registrations, continuing to roll in.
[00:08:11]All primary venues within the HIMSS 21 campus use hospital grade or better air ventilation systems, as well as GS neutral disinfectant cleaners on all high touch areas. To be honest with you, I don’t know what that means, but I assume that’s a very high grade disinfectant cleaner.
[00:08:29] The [00:08:30] ventilation systems in casinos and those buildings is high-grade already. So again, from that perspective, I think it’s pretty safe. Socially distanced seating options, where we provide an all venues exhibit hall will include wider aisles on the floor with boosts spaced apart. Attendees exhibitors and staff must complete an onsite at a station confirming compliance with all health and safety protocols.
[00:08:54] And they go on to say that they’re going to evaluate that on an ongoing basis. [00:09:00] Let me ask you this question. You wear two hats. You’re a vendor. You’re also a CIO. You’re sitting in the CIO chair right now. As a CIO, not going to HIMSS, I mean, Does that impact you all that much as a CIO?
[00:09:17] Sue Schade: [00:09:17] No. No. And it doesn’t impact me all that much, Yeah, so many things I want to say about HIMSS. And I also want to go back to some vaccine comments if I may. But let me answer your question about [00:09:30] HIMSS. As a CIO not attending HIMSS, I don’t think, especially now the impact is that big. I have always felt in the past and maybe this sounds a little I don’t know what it’s going to sound like, but in terms of the vendor floor and talking to vendors and seeing vendors, broadly organizations that I’d served as CIO, I never felt that I had to make sure I was there and saw kind of vendors because I knew from those organizations, I could get the vendors [00:10:00] to come to us or talk to us.
[00:10:01] Okay. So I would work the floor and look for it. Our core vendors to get updated, but then the new stuff. Right. So that was always useful. It seems like over time, you never get enough time to take advantage of some of the education. Some of the education is very good. Right. And maybe the advantage you have, if you decide to go all virtual, as you can focus on the education.
[00:10:23]Quite honestly, I did, as I said, register virtual. Maybe that was before we started [00:10:30] the recording and I tried to keep my calendar open but with my current commitments, that’s pretty difficult. So any tips on some like kind of must watch virtual sessions. I am open to see if I can fit them in.
[00:10:50] So I’d love to hear what you have to say about that. The networking aspect is always important, but you know CHIME fall forum, which I registered [00:11:00] for for late October. And we’ll see what that’s gonna look like. That’s a whole different kin of networking opportunity. Can I go back to the vaccine for a minute? I just wanna correct a number you were talking about around 60%. I saw yesterday that first dose is now 70%. So that milestone has been hit. That’s really good. I’m not sure on both doses. The other thing is more and more healthcare organizations that are requiring it.
[00:11:29] And [00:11:30] we, as of Monday, this week, Boston Children’s Hospital will be requiring it. We haven’t set the date yet, but we had an open session yesterday with leadership explaining that decision. Did a very good job explaining that decision as a healthcare organization and handled questions that of course people have. Though 83% of our employees currently are already vaccinated. Fully vaccinated though when you account for what they call associated personnel would, I guess I am as a contractor, [00:12:00] 64%. And I think some of that might be, they don’t know the vaccine status on everybody who’s not an employee. One more point I saw yesterday. New York city. And I think you might see these trends. New York city now is saying to go indoor dining and into theater venues you will have to prove vaccination.
[00:12:19] Bill Russell: [00:12:19] Oh, wow.
[00:12:22] Sue Schade: [00:12:22] Yeah. So you’re going to see more and more, I think of these kinds of requirements [00:12:30] broadly.
[00:12:31] Bill Russell: [00:12:31] Yeah. So for those who aren’t in the healthcare they’ll ask this question again. They don’t understand why you could hear it from both sides. So let me phrase it from this side. They don’t understand why all hospitals don’t make it mandatory. It is tricky. Isn’t it? It’s not as clear cut as you would think. Now we had mandatory flu shots every year. There’s a bunch of things I had to get mandatory when I went to work in healthcare that I didn’t have to in, in [00:13:00] general business. And so it’s common practice, but this vaccine isn’t FDA approved yet. And there’s just a bunch of things that are just make it hard for every hospital administration to just say, yeah, just like the flu shot. We’re going to do this across the board.
[00:13:17] Sue Schade: [00:13:17] Yeah. I think there’s a big difference on the flu shot and yeah non healthcare systems don’t require the flu shot, but you’re going to see more healthcare systems and more other private [00:13:30] employers require the vaccine. It’s going to happen. I think one of the complicating factors is the remote and some of my staff in it have asked that question, if we’re remote a hundred percent, why do we need to get the vaccine?
[00:13:44] Because everybody will be required, but you know, one answer there is you’re not really fully remote. There will be some times where you’re coming in. And if there was an emergency situation where we need everybody to come in, we can expect you to be there and to be [00:14:00] vaccinated. But I think we won’t go into politics Bill, but let’s just say was the flu shot ever in your experience politicized? Was the vaccine. Yeah. Yeah. You can get an exemption from the flu shot, I think for medical or religious reasons, probably in organizations. And then you just had to wear a mask that you can get those same exemptions for vaccine, but [00:14:30] then there’s the whole other category of people who won’t get it.
[00:14:34]Bill Russell: [00:14:34] We could have a whole discussion on this, but I don’t think that’s why people tune into the show. If they want to, they can tune into Andy Slavitt show and they could get a full discussion on this. Although it’s pretty much one sided but yes, they can get a full discussion on this.
[00:14:49] Sue Schade: [00:14:49] One sided or not, I say, listen to the science. And that’s one of the things that Boston Children’s did a really good job yesterday going over was helping people understand the science.
[00:14:57]Bill Russell: [00:14:57] But I will tell you. I’m reading these articles [00:15:00] as I come out and I’m reading studies as they come out and can you get COVID? Can you be a breakthrough case if you get the vaccine? And I read it. I read one study and it says one in a thousand. And then I read another study out of Massachusetts, which is pretty and actually it was reported on NPR. And I’m looking at it going that’s a much higher rate of people. Now we also know that if you have the vaccine the impact is a lot less and those kinds of things. The science seems to support that. I saw another study that said, essentially, take the vaccines out of [00:15:30] it and you have had COVID, that’s actually proving at this point to be a stronger deterrent. Had COVID recovered than getting the vaccine.
[00:15:39] And it seems to have a little bit more legs and longevity and I’m like, okay. I’m following these stories. What if I was reading one out of every five of these stories? I mean, there’s so many stories.
[00:15:51] Sue Schade: [00:15:51] I know. So I know you didn’t want to talk about this. I’m laughing though because I saw a cartoon last night on social media. [00:16:00] A man is sitting at his computer, woman’s walking away and he goes, honey, honey, I found a piece of information that all the scientists and experts missed. I’ll leave it there.
[00:16:14] Bill Russell: [00:16:14] If only they were all in agreement is what I’m saying. Yeah anyway. You and I could have a very dynamic conversation on this. Cause in my family, I took the approach of it’s your body. And one of my girls had COVID and she hasn’t gotten vaccinated [00:16:30] yet.
[00:16:30] My other daughter decided to get vaccinated. My wife just got vaccinated this week up until this week. She was sitting there going look, I’d like through this thing to get FDA approved before I get it. And I’m like, okay, I understand. I understand. And now it’s gotten far enough. She was like in the wait and see category and just wanted a little bit more whatever. And just this week, she’s like, well, you don’t seem to, it hasn’t impacted you that much. I guess it’s okay. And actually, I think we’re seeing the vaccination rate take a [00:17:00] little tick up right now.
[00:17:01] Sue Schade: [00:17:01] It is. Especially in the states that are hotspots, where there was low vaccination rates. The concept. And I’ve talked to people to the concept that it’s a pandemic of the unvaccinated is a kind of a way to frame it now, get the vaccine. Should we move on?
[00:17:17] Bill Russell: [00:17:17] No people are tuning it to listen to us talk aboutm what you know, anyway. Yeah. So I wanted to hit on what Epic was going to talk about at HIMSS as well. This is a Epic to launch Epic share at HIMSS 21.
[00:17:30] [00:17:30] Epic’s going to launch Epic Share aimed at providing a space for decision-makers to learn and share tips about health IR at the HIMS 2021 conference. The new site available on epic share.org is intended to offer insights and details on healthcare organizations, experiences so that other groups can replicate what works well.
[00:17:49] It’s interesting. I heard a heard or read somewhere where Judy was saying that the number one thing she wishes would happen is that all these health systems would learn from each other. [00:18:00] Because she gets the opportunity to talk to all of them. And she’s just like, if you would just do what this health system is done, and if this house is some would just do it.
[00:18:07] And so I think this is what this is aimed at. It’s a collaboration sharing platform where Epic users can go and really learn from one another. That’s that’s what I’m gaining from this. Do you have any more insight on Epic Share and what they’re thinking?
[00:18:21] Sue Schade: [00:18:21] I don’t I applaud them. In some respects, it didn’t sound that new new, given a lot of the [00:18:30] case studies and scoring that they do with their clients and sharing that they already do.
[00:18:36] I mean, I have a, I have a book full of case studies from other Epic clients that they sent me as we’re talking more about Epic and Cerner where I am but, I would just apply them somewhere in this article. It says something about oh, overall Epic spokesperson said they hope attendees take away from HIMSS is that [00:19:00] Epic goes beyond EHR software alone. They really do look at the health ecosystem in terms of what they’re trying to do and contribute. And I think thats a plus for them as a vendor.
[00:19:11] Bill Russell: [00:19:11] Yep, absolutely. They are also gonna have a feature wall. They’re going to talk about interoperability. And one of the things I say is out of the box, all of our customers are connected with a hundred percent of each other. I mean, I understand what they’re saying, have the capabilities there to be connected with a hundred percent of each other.
[00:19:27]As well as every other system that has joined Care quality [00:19:30] said an epic suppose person combined the exchange over 8.5 million records every day with around 50% of those exchanges occurring with other vendor systems. So that’s one thing attendees can also learn about the company’s moves around patient access.
[00:19:44] This is an important space as well. Epic was early to adopt FHIR beginning several years ago with the Oregon project and continuing today said spokesperson, a full suite of fire resources is available to our customers and patients choose which third-party apps they like to share [00:20:00] data with using open standards.
[00:20:01]Again, applaud them that they’re adopting fire. I think they’re trying to spin a story. They may have been yes working with FHIR early on but to say they weren’t an early proponent. They could may have been an early adopter, but but no, this is great. I’m glad they’re making that move. I’m glad they’re highlighting interoperability. I think they’re trying to get ahold of the narrative that Epic is against interoperability. This is a good move to get in front of that.
[00:20:27]Sue Schade: [00:20:27] Yeah, I agree. And what vendor doesn’t do since [00:20:30] then Bill, right? Going back the virtual attendance, have you researched now that you have flipped, I heard your health IT Today and your decision to attend virtually and not in person. How will you be able to see stuff about the vendors? Have you figured that out yet?
[00:20:47] Bill Russell: [00:20:47] I have not figured that out yet. Part of this is I’m signed up as media, so I get a bow every hour on the hour I’m getting about 10 [00:21:00] plus emails from various vendors. So I have a pretty good window into what they’re trying to do and trying to get out there.
[00:21:08] And what I’m going to try to do on the show is identify those that are linked to healthcare delivery, hospitals and healthcare delivery, and pull some of those in and do shows around them. So, but you know, in terms of the booth experience I’m not trying to make enemies here. I’m just trying to make people aware of this. The last CHIME event I went to. And the one before that, I thought they [00:21:30] did a good job in terms of visiting the sponsors and that kind of stuff. It was as good as they can do from a digital plan. But it did leave you wanting it. Wasn’t like, it’s not the same as walking up to a booth and I don’t need the juggler or the magician or whatever, but there’s something about, there’s something about, Hey, let me grab this expert over here and they pull them in and you get the full whatever on that thing. And it’s just hard to pull that off digitally at this point.
[00:22:00] [00:22:00] Sue Schade: [00:22:00] Yeah, well, they probably I’ll have to do some research this weekend to figure out how that’s gonna work and what I can get from it. I’m always a HIMMS attendee in person just in time, figuring out my game plan. So I’ll be a virtual attendee just in time this week to try and figure it out.
[00:22:16]Bill Russell: [00:22:16] I had your partner David Muntz on about two years ago. Before the HIMSS and he just had this, he goes, this is, he gave just a playbook. If you’re going to HIMSS this is what you do. And I’m not sure that’s [00:22:30] changed, cause one of the things I’m doing is all right, I’m going to miss out on the networking. So I literally have a call sheet here of people I’m going to reach out to and have conversations with that I would normally see at a conference that I’m not going to see. I’m not going to let my networking lapse just because they’re not doing this event and I won’t do the same thing around the, it’s not hard to get a list of everyone who’s presenting and say, you know what? I want to learn more about robotic process automation. I think there’s going to be some movement there. Identify the five or six companies that are there. [00:23:00] And I don’t know, do a little bit of the research people have they’ve been on shows. And others that are out there. Health system CIO does a webinars as does a Health Impact.
[00:23:12] There’s a lot of different webinars out there that you can really fine tune and hone in on things and get a lot of information that way. Then you could you can reach out, like you’re talking about and have people just do a Zoom session with your team around what is [00:23:30] Olive AI doing around around robotic process automation.
[00:23:34]They’ll give you the presentation they were going to do at HIMSS. Just at the, at the drop of a hat. Really?
[00:23:41] Sue Schade: [00:23:41] Yeah. You know what I liked back to your Today in Health IT. Where you talked about HIMSS and doing virtual and I love your so what approach at the end of every one? That’s that’s great.
[00:23:54] You’re so what I think on that one was [00:24:00] beyond HIMSS, what are you doing for yourself and your staff to continue to grow and develop and learn, right? That’s when the opportunity is. Whether it’s learning about vendors that you need to know more about and potentially bring in or learning what your peers are doing.
[00:24:13] Bill Russell: [00:24:13] Yeah, absolutely. And one of the ways that you can learn about what your peers are doing is healthcare IT news over the last three months has done a series of really good, I think a series of really good interviews with people. Also some leaders I’ll give, just give you a [00:24:30] couple of the titles here.
[00:24:31] CIOs and innovation officers bolster clinical informatics, cyber defense and more. And they have four, four people they interviewed. How the pandemic has reshaped CIO’s views on adaptability, agility, security and hiring. CIOs tackle barriers to innovation, telehealth, integration, analytics, and more. Pandemic allows CIOs to move with new speed but cyber threats lie in wait.
[00:24:52] Again, this is all part of a series. If you go to healthcare IT news, click on the HIMSS coverage. This is all part of a series that they’ve been doing on lessons learned [00:25:00] through the pandemic. How IT leaders are re-imagining and repurposing technology standalone new challenges. IT execs talk new strategies for analytics, patient engagement, telehealth and more. CIOs plan on refined telehealth faster deployments, more collaborative tools and CIO must is reduce bureaucracy, boost patient experience and improve data governance. And great set of articles. What I did with you a nd what we’re going to do today is, we both took these articles. We read through them and found like two or three things.
[00:25:28] We’re just going to go back and forth. [00:25:30] Like these are best practices. What people learned, I’m going to let you kick it off with just one of the, one of the things that you pulled out of these artists.
[00:25:39] Sue Schade: [00:25:39] Okay. The one I’m going to talk about is the second one on the list you gave me how the pandemic has reshaped CIO views on adaptability, agility, security, and hiring.
[00:25:47]And before I go to a particular part there to highlight. Thank you for highlighting these, because I think this is an excellent series that I hadn’t been watching. And [00:26:00] I couldn’t help, but think as I was reading about your I sound like a huge fan, I am, I am Bill, but your series last year during the pandemic. Well, the pandemic is still with us, right. But your series with CIOs, which was much more real time, like how you dealing with things, what have you done? This is a chance, even though it’s still with me. For CIO is to look back a bit and what are their key takeaway lessons?
[00:26:25] So the one I want to highlight here is from Beth Lindsay Wood who is the CIO at [00:26:30] Moffitt Cancer Center in Florida. And she talked about leveraging a model called radical interdependence. RI. Have you heard that? Did they make that up or is that a model that I not. Okay. A model called radical interdependence to ensure they engage and empower teams to work together, which is so critical in this remote world.
[00:26:50] I mean, I feel like I continue to struggle with it with my team, but they seem to be doing better than me. But they all worked together before. Right. And that’s the difference, but [00:27:00] she says her great ideas come from amazing places in the organization. Sometimes leadership needs to get out of the way. Love it. Yes. Sometimes leadership needs to get out of the way. The best thing they can do is let teams work together without walls or different priorities and allow failure of ideas. My vision of without walls is having a big open space with mobile desks that allow people to join teams, to solve specific problems.
[00:27:24]I love that concept. Again in a, still a largely virtual world and a [00:27:30] continuing virtual world. In some respects, you have that big open space. It’s just a lot of little zoom boxes on your screen, but you can get to anybody kind of at any time without maybe the physical constraints.
[00:27:45] Good and bad on the virtual, I would say. I wanted to highlight that I want to highlight something else that she talks about which was in this section here, getting things done. And the bottom line of it was, they did a lot of [00:28:00] recruitment to support growth. They figured out how to recruit during the pandemic.
[00:28:03] And they also didn’t put a lot of their big initiatives on the back burner. They figured out how to get things done through the pandemic to keep moving. Priority initiatives going, which I thought was someone inspiring. So I think a lot of organizations put a lot on the back burner in 2020.
[00:28:22]Bill Russell: [00:28:22] Yeah. And that’s, they’re all coming around right now. So this is what I’m hearing from various clients, whatnot.
[00:28:28]Sue Schade: [00:28:28] I work at Boston [00:28:30] Children’s. A lot of stuff put on the back burner in 2020.
[00:28:33]Bill Russell: [00:28:33] I’m pulling from Pandemic allowed CIOs to move with new speed but cyber threats lie in wait.
[00:28:37] And I I was reading this and I thought it was interesting, Cris Ross CIO for Mayo Clinic at the end, it says healthcare has some baked in vulnerabilities and it’s medical devices, open campuses. And for many researchers who prize academic freedom, he said, we cannot eliminate those vulnerabilities though in the mid and longterm, the medical device [00:29:00] manufacturers have to find a better way to work with regulators to stop exposing us to unacceptable risks. He said, we all need to implement compensating controls and protections. To mitigate unacceptable risks. And we’ve talked about that several times on the show.
[00:29:13] I thought the next thing he said is really interesting. Mayo clinic’s defense patch posture is multi-part, but we know that software as a service and platform, as a service capabilities are inherently more secure and segregated and provide less vulnerability than on-premise computing. He explained we sold our major data centers six [00:29:30] years ago and are moving all we can to SAS and software as a service and platform as a service providers with a strong trust, but verify ethos. It’s interesting that he would say that I’m not sure I would go as far to say that. I’m a huge cloud proponent. I think your on-premise computing can be equally as strong as your your cloud provider, but I love is how he closes that with a trust but verify ethos. And I think that’s what we’re learning [00:30:00] is we have business associates, we need a trust, but verify ethos around.
[00:30:05] We have medical devices. We need a trust but verify ethos around. We have software providers. It is one of those situations that we live in today, which is just you can’t just buy things off the shelf, put them in and not have a strong plan around keeping them updated, keeping them patched keeping the firmware modified, but also verifying did they do a good job with that? We learned this [00:30:30] with Solar Winds. That Solar Winds thing was an attack directly on IT. Now, it wasn’t just healthcare IT. It was all of it, but that was directly focused on it. And Solar Winds was in use in a lot of places. It was a very inexpensive way to monitor an entire network.
[00:30:47]We do need to take a trust but verify to every aspect of what we’re doing in IT. So I thought that was an interesting lesson learned from from Cris Ross. What’s your next one?
[00:30:59]Sue Schade: [00:30:59] The [00:31:00] CIOs tackle barriers to innovation telehealth integration, analytics and more. And I actually wanted to highlight one that is not in that title of the article. And that’s the comments from Dan Waltz, who’s the CIO at MidMichigan health. Actually I know Dan well. He was on my team when I was CIO for University of Michigan health system hospitals and health centers.
[00:31:23]But in that part of the article, that section says authenticity, vulnerability and transparency in place. [00:31:30] I mean, if you look at what people went through in 2020 and well into 21, people are exhausted. You come to value and appreciate people I think in a different way. You came to know and work with people in a different way. He describes them one of the natural disasters on top of the pandemic, and there were many natural disasters on top of the pandemic for many organization. They had a huge flood in that part of Michigan. I know I talked to him during that time and he had people who lost their homes on his team [00:32:00] that was staying with him in his home.
[00:32:01] Right. So he talks in this article about the importance of just really connecting to people where they’re at and some of the things that he’s done in working with his team, having virtual lunch, Every week with people and that, that personal side of leadership. And I think that’s, I think that’s pretty powerful, not just during this period all the time, but especially now.
[00:32:25] Bill Russell: [00:32:25] You know what, one of the people who I’ve watched and used [00:32:30] to be a client of mine is not right now is Dr. Milligan. Lee Milligan out of Oregon. He writes some of the best letters to his teams and it’s personal and it’s inspiring but it also gets the job done and he does that on a pretty regular basis. He does that kind of stuff. He’s very active in social media. If you see any of his people post he’s encouraging them. And then he’s doing all the video stuff as well, that needs to, and I’m sitting there going, [00:33:00] that’s somebody who recognizes that the office has changed and the office is now it’s Microsoft Teams is part of the office. And social media is part of the office and email, that inbox is part of the office as well. And he does video stuff as well. He does a great job. And I think that was one of the mindset shifts that happened.
[00:33:20] I do want to talk to you about telehealth. Actually, I’ll start with this and then we’ll come back to telehealth. So from this article, CIO must use reduce bureaucracy boost, patient [00:33:30] experience and improve data.
[00:33:31]Dr. Brett Oliver with Baptist Health, somebody who I highly respect said during the past 12 months, baptist Health and himself as has learned that the bar has been raised substantially for patient experience and the desire for virtual care. No longer can health systems think of simply standing up a portal as a simple repository of information as satisfactory. While the patient experience has always seemed a soft endpoint to me, with my clinical background, I [00:34:00] historically would concern myself with more quality metrics, testifying to do great patient care rather than patients experience that has changed with COVID-19. He goes on to say that while touchless check-in two-way texting wayfinding, limiting time and waiting rooms. It started in COVID. Those new expectations have been raised for the industry as we emerge out of the pandemic.
[00:34:20]That is one of the things I’m hearing. I’m hearing from CIOs and it’s interesting because I’m hearing it in a way that is not, I know what I’m doing more like, Hey, [00:34:30] what are you doing? Because this is a new muscle for us. Not that we didn’t do some of this before, but that we’re really trying to do this at scale.
[00:34:38]It’s a lot of new skills for us. Not that selecting technology, doing contracts, all that is, but integrating it closely with an eye on the patient. We can say what we want, but we’ve been 80% focused on the clinician experience and 20% focused on the patient experience.
[00:34:55] And we’re seeing that tip a little bit and people are gone. [00:35:00] So are you finding that patients like to interact with texts more than video, more than a tele-health and, and th they’re actually asking those questions. Okay. Where do I get those metrics on my community? Where do I out, what tools are best in that category?
[00:35:14] And so I’m seeing a lot of people taking a very, a great approach, a very, Hey, I want to learn, what’s worked in other industries. I want to work, learn. What’s working in urban, see what can be applied to rural and those kinds of things. So I’m [00:35:30] using that as a background of expectations have changed. And you and I talked a little bit about telehealth prior to the call. What are we seeing in telehealthright now?
[00:35:40] Sue Schade: [00:35:40] Okay, great tee up. I told you I had some data for you. So broadly what I hear is, okay, it’s leveling out at some point, what’s it leveling out at? Where does it still make sense and how do we make sure that it’s a great patient experience and well-integrated and workable for the clinicians in terms of their workflows. So as long [00:36:00] as I’m interim CIO at Boston Children’s Hospital. I participate in the children’s hospital association PIO group.
[00:36:06] We have a monthly hot topics forum where we can bring up anything. We have the standard discussion forum where you can pose a question. And everybody within a short period of time, usually answers the questions and helps each other. So I’ve posted a few out there. It’s been very useful.
[00:36:21] One of them that was posed recently was around where are you? Where is telehealth right now? And the percent ambulatory visits that are tele-ed [00:36:30] we’re actually, Boston still talks about the top of that, with 33%. So that’s pretty, that’s still a pretty high number. There’s a couple here in the high twenties and mid twenties percent. There’s probably about a bowlus of them, maybe a bell curve here are between 10 and 20%. And then there’s just a small handful that are under 10%. And our breakout, cause he asked for that and that was useful to kind of tease it out. So it’s [00:37:00] 33% in primary care twenty-five percent for specialties. 94% for behavioral medicine. Okay and 50% of adolescent medicine. So still pretty high.
[00:37:14] Bill Russell: [00:37:14] Yeah that is pretty high. That’s what we’re seeing across the board, not just in the children’s hospitals, it’s roughly that it’s a 10 to 20 and then 20 to 30. What do you think makes a difference between 10 and 30%? Is it the quality of the experience? [00:37:30] Is it the offerings? Is it being able to have enough offerings? Maybe there’s not a complete set of offerings at some of the systems?
[00:37:38]Sue Schade: [00:37:38] I don’t know, but I’m looking at the data here and the other ones that are 20% and above are in dense metropolitan areas.
[00:37:50] So if you are again, children’s hospitals, if you are a parent with a the child, with the visits that you can do [00:38:00] telehealth and not the commut e that probably is a factor in particular in those areas. Yeah, I mean, I’m just scanning down this list.
[00:38:09]Bill Russell: [00:38:09] I’d want to talk to Dallas and Houston. I’d love to talk to Myra.
[00:38:13] Sue Schade: [00:38:13] Myra, if I have it right, is at 16% Texas Houston.
[00:38:19] Bill Russell: [00:38:19] Yeah, because it’s not as dense as Boston. Boston is very dense.
[00:38:23] Sue Schade: [00:38:23] No it’s the dense ones here at the top of this list, Boston 33%, Stanford. So that’s [00:38:30] San Francisco Bay area, Seattle that’s and DC.
[00:38:35]Bill Russell: [00:38:35] Yeah. So those are highly dense. The reason I was talking about Dallas and Houston is because they’re dense, but they’re, they’re really spread out. I mean, you could have people driving from Waco to go to Dallas for a children’s hospital visit. I mean, that’s, that’s an hour and a half, two hour drive.
[00:38:53]Sue Schade: [00:38:53] One other point I’d make on this would be some of the leading hospitals that have a broader because of their [00:39:00] special, a broader reach potentially, regionally. Not just if you live in the Boston area to really want to drive to a visit if you could do telehealth, but just think of the broader reach for some of the subspecialties in some of the leading children’s hospitals. I think there’s as much as I can analyze that data.
[00:39:20] Bill Russell: [00:39:20] You know what? This is going to be an interesting one to follow and we’ll close here cause we’re coming close to the time. And I know your day job of being a CIO, as opposed to a guest host on the show.
[00:39:29] Sue Schade: [00:39:29] I [00:39:30] love this job.
[00:39:31] Bill Russell: [00:39:31] This is, this is going to be an interesting one to follow because there’s a lot of activity. There’s almost no one I’ve talked to that isn’t exploring how to integrate this into their digital experience, integrate this into their front door, integrat it into their workflows. And I think if you fast forward, let’s assume HIMSS next year as a wild success and in the spring, we have 30,000 people back. I have a feeling we’re going to have some really fun and interesting [00:40:00] stories that people are going to start sharing. And if we get that good dynamic back and forth, we’re going to see real movement in this and make no mistake 10 to 20% movement in a year is unbelievable.
[00:40:16] So if we’re if we’re able to maintain that and even grow it another 10% in 2022, that would be another, from an access standpoint and potentially a cost standpoint, that could be a real big [00:40:30] game that it is helping to enable for the health system. Sue always great to sit down with you. I look forward to seeing what your new studio looks like at some point.
[00:40:42] Sue Schade: [00:40:42] Oh My new house.
[00:40:44] Bill Russell: [00:40:44] Yeah. You’ll probably paint the walls, the same thing and put up the same paintings and I won’t even know.
[00:40:49] Sue Schade: [00:40:49] You know, I can’t lose my RBG look Bill.
[00:40:53] Bill Russell: [00:40:53] There it is.
[00:40:54] Sue Schade: [00:40:54] All right. Thank you. It’s always a pleasure. We cover a lot of good stuff today.
[00:40:58] Bill Russell: [00:40:58] Fantastic. Thank you.
[00:40:59] Sue Schade: [00:40:59] Have a [00:41:00] good HIMSS next week, virtually.
[00:41:02]Bill Russell: [00:41:02] What a great discussion. If you know someone that might benefit from our channel, from these kinds of discussions, please forward them a note, perhaps your team, your staff. I know if I were a CIO today, I would have every one of my team members listening to this show. It’s conference level value every week. They can subscribe on our website thisweekhealth.com or they can go wherever you listen to podcasts, Apple, Google, Overcast, which is what I use, Spotify, Stitcher. You name it. We’re out there. They can find us. [00:41:30] Go ahead. Subscribe today. Send a note to someone and have them subscribe as well. We want to thank our channel sponsors who are investing in our mission to develop the next generation of health IT leaders. Those are VMware, Hill-Rom, StarBridge Advisers, Aruba and McAfee. Thanks for listening. That’s all for now.